Elena: Anatomy of a Scammer

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Elena 1

… Elena, a bona fide Ukraine dating scammer…

Of all of the topics that I’ve written about on the subject of dating Eastern European Women, the topic that I’m most often asked about are my own personal dating experiences. How long did it take for me to find Alana? How many women did I meet? Did I have any romances or relationships with other EE (Eastern European) Women? Was I ever scammed?

If you’ve read this blog, then you know that I’ve been scammed. And I consider myself rather lucky. I only spent about $500 in membership fees to a scam site and probably about another $1k – $2k dating scammer women. I met a lot of men who spent into the tens of thousands of dollars.

There is a wise old saying that says “Learn from your mistakes.” I would suggest that there is an even better and wiser course of action: “Learn from the mistakes of others.”

If we were all wildebeests in Africa and we were about to cross an open field that you knew (from past experience) was full of lions, would you find a different way? Of course. And if you watched one wildebeest begin to cross and then get devoured by lions, would you follow? Of course not. Not only is it a good idea to learn from our mistakes, but in some cases (like getting eaten by a lion), it makes more sense to learn from the mistakes of others.

With this in mind, I am writing this post so that those of you that are in a similar position (or will be in the future) – you can learn from my mistakes.

Elena 2

Some years ago, about the time I started writing this blog, I had a membership at an EE dating website that was – well, lets say “less than honest.” I was on my way to Ukraine to visit for a few weeks and I posted my profile, a few photos, a description of myself and an announcement that I was coming and wanted to meet my future wife. Of the dozens and dozens (and dozens) of women that “replied” to my post, one was Elena (featured here).

I looked at Elena’s photos and as you can see, she is quite beautiful. She wrote that she was attracted to my appearance and that she was very much looking forward to my visit.

Needless to say, I was quite excited.

Elena 3

Hindsight being 20/20, I’ve learned a LOT about what constitutes a legitimate EE dating profile. The first 7 photos in this post are the photos that she had listed in her “profile.” What should stand out is that none of them are candid shots. None are taken by her family, colleagues at work, none taken by grandma and none in “regular” clothes in “regular” places. These are all professional style model photos. This girl is either trying to get a job as a model or she paid to have these photos taken for the express purpose of scamming Western Men. Or, she doesn’t exist at all and these photos were stolen from a modeling agency or website. In the case of our profiled scammer Elena, she was in fact a real woman and these are her photos. I did meet and date her (or so I thought). I believe that we had 4 or 5 meetings and in “dating” her I gained a PhD in EE scammers.

Elena 4

I had my first date with Elena and it was delightful. She was very attentive to everything I said and she had a coy if not submissive demeanor that made her seem even more appealing. I remember when we went to a sushi restaurant, she made sure to pour some soy sauce into my little dipping bowl before pouring some for herself. She asked about my university ring that I proudly wore and she seemed to hang on every detail as I described my work and travels.

Our date went on and on for about 3 or 4 hours. At its conclusion, I paid our interpreter (Elena didn’t speak English) and we made plans to meet again. The prices for interpreters have gone up to about $15-20 per hour but back in 2009 I was paying about $10 per hour. While the cost of living in Ukraine may be cheap, eating at Sushi restaurants in the city center is NOT cheap. The bill was perhaps $80 or $90. After paying the translator, I was out about $120.

If a woman like Elena works as a receptionist or secretary, she maybe will earn $300-$500 per month working 40 hours a week, 4 weeks a month. I just paid the interpreter $40. From what I will later come to learn is that the two women would split the commission between them. About $20 for 4 hours of work. Not bad if you can pick up two or three dates on Saturday or Sunday each week. Besides getting a nice meal and some drinks, a woman and her interpreter can make $100 or $200 per weekend.

Elena 5

I noticed, on our first “date” that neither woman was in any hurry to finish up. They seemed so interested in everything I said. Of course, they are getting paid to listen.

It was much the same on the second date. No rush. Take your time. And the third date I became suspicious. Elena was always eager to set the next date, usually a day or two later.

WWS recommended site: Russian Cupid Russian Cupid

I watched and I listened with ever growing suspicion. And by the fourth date I realized something was amiss. I didn’t tell either woman that I could speak and understand some Russian and after one date, Elena excused herself to take a call and I listened in. While I can’t say with 100% certainty, it sounded like she was talking to a boyfriend or a husband and she was inquiring how her son was doing. On our final date, I asked if she had any children from previous relationships and she said “no.”

Elena 6

On our third date Elena and her interpreter took me on a walking tour of Odessa. They showed me all of the tourist sites and famous bridges and landmarks. She and I posed for photos together as if we were boyfriend and girlfriend. Looking back on it, it all seemed quite normal. But with full hindsight, there were so many warning signs. I just wasn’t keen to them.

Of course, the walking tour conveniently ended at a luxurious restaurant. Elena told me that it was a new restaurant and she had never eaten there before. “Could we have lunch there?” I agreed and the bill wasn’t cheap.

Bite me once, shame on you. Bite me twice? Never.

I learned my lesson and never repeated.

Elena 7

After our 4th or 5th date, I suggested to Elena that we should have a date without the interpreter. Just she and I; perhaps we could use Google Translate on my iPhone to communicate. Maybe we could have a date centered more around feelings and chemistry and less about talking. She smiled and said that this was a great idea and we made a date for two days later.

Later that afternoon, I received this text:

“I am only looking for a serious man, not someone who plays games. I do not wish to see you again.”

I chalked up the whole experience to a life lesson and moved on. Later, I was a bit curious and Google searched her and found her personal profile on a Russian Facebook style website. You can see the photos she shows to friends and family are quite different than the photos above that were on the dating website. If you’re looking at profiles online, you want iPhone selfie photos, photos at family events or a snapshot taken by a girlfriend at a local park, something like this:

Elena 8

I certainly don’t want this post to sound like sour grapes. I’m not complaining that I was scammed. Sure, shame on these ladies for running this scam but it takes a willing sucker for any scam to work. And in this case, I was the sucker. My best advice would be to “step outside” of the situation and try to analyze it impartially. When you’re with a beautiful woman who pays attention to you, this isn’t always easy. In the case of Elena and her interpreter, they were consummate pros. They knew exactly how to apply just enough pressure and insistence without going overboard. I fancy myself a sharp guy but it was even hard for me to figure it out. It took 4 or 5 dates but then I saw that some things just didn’t add up.

You really really have to look at the situation critically. And only then, will you see if the woman is romantically interested. If, date after date, it comes off like a meeting with your tax accountant, you’ll know that something is amiss.

DSC00481

In the photo below, you can see Elena and her scammer interpreter. I can only laugh at myself now as I see that their smiles aren’t, “What a great guy, we’re so glad to be on the town with him,” but were instead, “How long can we string this sucker along? Keep smiling, so long as he’s paying.”

DSC00523

I truly believe that there is someone out there for everyone. In the case of Eastern Europe, yes, I truly believe that there is a special woman that God on this planet just for you. She will make you happier than you can ever imagine. I speak from experience: Alana has made me the happiest man alive.

To avoid getting scammed you must:

* Only go with a reputable agency. Dating through sites like Anastasiadate.com will only lead to sorrow and expense.

* Only date English-speaking women unless you speak Russian. It is hard enough to read emotions through an interpreter; even harder at $20 per hour.

* Watch for subtle signs: a woman who is interested in you will be happy to walk in the park and chat. Sure, you should take her to dinner at dinner time. But be wary of attempts to order the $200 bottle of champagne from the restaurant.

* If you do become romantically involved with a woman, read read read her body language. Do you feel like she’s “just tolerating” your touch or can she barely keep her hands off of you? If the former, run, don’t walk away. If the later, enjoy it and be doubly sure that you are compatible to spend the next 50 years together.

* Does she excuse herself to take phone calls or act in other suspicious ways? This is a bad sign. Does she bring along her sister or best friend to meet you? This is a good sign. A woman won’t introduce you to ANYONE SHE KNOWS if she’s scamming you. I’m sure that Elena’s parents and old classmates don’t know she’s a dating scammer. If she insists at meeting in “out of the way places,” this is also a red flag.

* Trust your gut instinct. If it feels wrong, it probably is.

Good luck on your search!

#westernwomensuck

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30 thoughts on “Elena: Anatomy of a Scammer

  1. Are there women there that look like her that are not scammers and are very serious about marriage, future motherhood, and family life?

    • ” Anatomy of an Angel ”

      It was in the early beginning , of November , last year , that my girl , did send me , a nice picture.
      Well , she had been sending me , other nice photos , yes , through the months.But this one , was rather special , if I may say so.

      Try to imagine this.She had put some hair extensions , in the (almost) same colour , of her hair.Remember , that she asked me , 2 times, on 2 different dates , if I like the colour of her hair.

      She was wearing , this skirt – which looked a lot – that you may have seen , the ballet dancers wear , in the Swan Lake ballet.Only , this one , was a bit longer , than those.Still , it didn`t reach , over the knees.
      On the front side, she had pulled it up , very high ( about half way , from her knees , to her hips )

      She was wearing this white top (no sleeves), with the U-shape , on the front.The U-shape , was extremely low.So , you could see , almost half of the bra , that she was wearing.

      On this , she put a wide – light gray shiny – belt , with a real , big buckle.The colour , and material from the bra , were almost , the same , as that from the belt.

      She had done her eye lashes , and had some powder on her cheeks.She was wearing , very red hot lipstick , and had some shiny , silver like , eye shadow (with those silver particles).

      With her left hand , she was holding the hem of the skirt.And to top , it all of , she was wearing , high heels.

      Now , imagine , that she is standing , next to a big tree , somewhere , in a park , or a wooden area – ( in the distance , you can see , the shape of buildings – houses ).
      The yellow – brown leaves , were on the ground , but there were , stil enough leaves , on the trees.

      It looked , like a very sunny and dry day.But , I know , that sometimes , in November , there can already , be a bit of cold wind.And , she doesn’t like the cold.
      As a finishing touch , she had those , medium sized , white angel wings , on her back.

      Can you imagine , my surprise , when I first saw the photo ??She did sent it to me , in a good quality.So , no problem , to enlarge it.
      I carefully inspected the picture.

      I am a amateur photographer , so , I always , look at the composition , and other details.In this case , it was a rather good shot.Though , I`m not sure , who made it.But , I will find out.
      I checked out the picture , for some days , while I was thinking , ” did she really , made it , just for ME ” ???

      After a couple of days , I called her , to ask her , if indeed , she had made it , for me , to surprise me.A bit shyishly laughing , she said , yes.
      So , then I asked her – ” so , you are an angel for me ” ??

      Again , shyishly laughing , she answered , yes !Wow , I thought , is this for real !Is she actually saying , that she went through all this trouble , only to make this photo , for me ??
      Buying all these costume , getting the angel wings , the belt , bra , and then drive over , to the park ???

      Of course , I was rather pleased , with this.But something , was a little odd , about the photo.With her left arm , she was pressing , a beige teddy bear , of about 45 centimeters , against her body.

      For some days , I was wondering , what that teddy , was doing , in this angel theme.I couldn`t understand it.
      And then , suddenly , it hit me!!!

      For about a year ago , I did sent her flowers , with a teddy.Only , I had ordered , a white one.And , while I was there , I asked her , if she had received the teddy.She told me , yes , she had.She also said , that my teddy , was the number 10 ( because she has more teddies ).

      No , I didn`t ask her , where she got the other ones from.So , now , I was thinking ,could it be , that it is my teddy , that she is holding , in the picture ??
      I said , well , I must ask her .

      So , after a couple of days , I called her again, and I said : ” the teddy , in the photo , is the one , that I have sent , to you ” ??

      And , yes , again , shyishly laughing , she said , yes .I said , oohh , so you are holding it , as if it is me , who is there with you ???

      Well , I believe , that you know the answer – by now.

      Wow , all that I can say : what an incredible woman …

      I don`t know about you guys.But , there was never a woman , who did dress up , like an angel for me.Nor , that there was ever one , who made such a photo for me.

      She made the picture , after I had met her sister , mother , best friend.And , I had returned back home.
      Just to remind you , it will not come easy.You need to work on the relation.

      It will take energy , and a strong will , to make your dream , come true.Even , more so , with a long distance relation.But , the reward , is worth , every second , of your hard work.

      Oh , and , yes , she did change , into normal clothes , after the angel pictures , were taken.Because , she also did send me , another photo , in the same park , with her short fur coat (she did wear it , when I was there , on my second trip).

      Between these 2 pictures , was a 15 minute difference , that I could see , in the exif data.Pictures were taken , at around 15.00 hrs

      So , now I am on cloud nine , so to speak

      Paul

  2. And I consider myself , lucky also.Yes , I may have blown about 3 ~ 4k US $ , on scammers.But , then I found , enough information , on the net , about all these methods , and the way , that they operate.

    So , this site , has also been , a good place , to learn about , what is going on.And , it also tells a bit , about the real situation , in different EE countries.
    I must admit , that I did not travel , that much around , in Eastern Europe.

    As I wrote , in another post , I had a Polish girlfriend , and had a long term relationship , with her.So , when things were getting a bit serious , naturally , she wanted , to introduce me , to her mother.
    Her father died , when she was young , so she hardly knew him.And she was raised , just by her mother.

    But her mother was still living in Poland.At that time , Poland was a country , in the U.S.S.R.We would go by car , and it was the first time , that I would make this trip.
    Although , I did ask for info , and made inquiries , what I could expect , along the way.

    People , who had made this trip , by car many times , gave me valuable details.And so , I was driving , in Poland , for about 3 hours.
    When I had to take a 90 degree turn , to the right.And , yes , after about 250 meters , I was stopped , by 2 police men.

    My knowledge of the Polish language , was absolutely zero , and I couldn`t speak it either.But , my companions , did.And , so they translated , for me , that the police officer said , that I had been speeding , before , I made the right turn.

    I am absolutely sure , that it wasn`t the case.And that is what I replied.But they insisted , and said , that they had checked my speed , with the radar.
    Neither I , or my co-passengers , had noticed such equipment.We are talking , July/August 1977.

    So , it was quite clear , that it was just , to get some money , of those stupid foreigners , in their fancy Western car.Under protest , I agreed , to pay the fine , so we could continue our journey.
    It was obvious , that they would play this trick , on every foreign car , until their shift , was ended.

    So , welcome to communism.I should also mention , that this was the only time , that I got a speeding ticket in Poland.I drove back , many times after this , but I was never stopped again , by police men.

    While in Poland , on vacation , I did got to know , and see , how life was , under Sovjet rule.I could not have gotten , any closer , to the people`s daily life.My girlfriend , told me many things , about , what the people were thinking.But then , you could not speak your mind , openly.

    All this , gave me insight , and a better understanding , how the people were controlled , by the communist party.

    So , with all this experience , I went to Ukraine , in 2012 , to meet the woman , that I had been corresponding with.Yes , it was on a site , where you had to pay credits , for every letter , that you receive and send.

    As , it was my first trip , to an EE country , after the break up , of the USSR , I was a bit excited , but I was going all by myself.And , I don`t speak Russian or Ukrainian.

    I believed , that I had prepared , myself , as good , as was possible.And , just in case , it would not work out , did I had a back up plan ??
    Well , not really.I thought , I will just see it , as a vacation , and can go back , a second time.

    I really was not in a hurry , to come home , with a wife.After all, there are soooo many women , there!!So , what is the rush ?? And I certainly , would not want , to fall in the hands , of scammers.

    I paid all the necessary charges , to have a meeting , with the lady.I was under the assumption , that I would meet , with the woman , on the second day , after my arrival.That was wrong.

    I would arrive , on Thursday afternoon , but I could only have the first meeting , on Saturday evening.So , after just 2 days , we could meet.Well , of course , I didn`t knew , that she was a scammer, so , you will not make a point , of this.

    Anyway , I could use those days , to get a bit familiar , with the city , and the people.Needless to say , that the buildings , and the streets , reminded me very much , of Poland , back in 1977.Although , you can see , that there is some progress, and , newer and better buildings , found their way , in Ukraine.

    To make a long story short, on the first date , we went to a expensive restaurant.Well , I had calculated this , so it was not a real problem.And , I was used , to the idea, that the man pays for everything.
    Back then in Poland , things were no different.So , again , no surprise for me here.

    I had to look , very close and careful.But , after a good comparison , of “her” pictures on the profile , and her real face , I could see , some differences.The other factor , which I found a bit odd , was that the translator , was planning ALL the dates for her.And the translator , WAS PRESENT ON ALL THE DATES!!!

    To be sure , that she was a scammer , I asked some questions , that I had asked her , in the correspondence.Needless , to say , that either , I got no answer , or it was wrong.

    We also , never , did go , out of town.Or made a walk , through the city , or part of it.The dates with her , were also lasting about 3 hours max.On the 3rd date , she and the translator , took me to a restaurant (to me the prices looked the same) , and after that , took me to the shopping mall.

    As I had read , here on this blog , this is what they do.But , guys , it was all new to me.The mall looked very nice and modern.
    You don`t need to be a professor , to understand , that the salaries in Ukraine , are (very) low.To me , it all seemed , like Poland , in 1977 , but with new buildings , and a bit more freedom.

    So , yes , I could understand , that she wanted , to take this opportunity , to get 1 or 2 presents , from me.Like , I mentioned , I understand , their life , and the daily struggle.
    So , I bought her some nice pink lady boots , and another item.But I forgot , what that was.
    Do I feel bad about it ??Certainly not.
    After all , I had spent much money , in helping the family , and other relatives , in Poland.

    And this is my other point , that I want to make.These people , they care a lot about each other.Sure , they can have their different opinions.But , when a family member or a relative , needs help , they will have no second thoughts about it.

    I am sure , that those guys , who have an EE or Russian wife , will agree on this.Their family (bonds) is very important for them.
    Don`t ever say , that you don`t like their family.It may be the end , of your marriage.

    After 3 dinners in total , and on the 4th day , I had a meeting with the translator , alone.And then I told her , that I would not have another date ,with the lady.
    When she asked me why , I said , that she is not the woman, from the pictures , in the profile.

    Her immediate reaction was , that SHE , had nothing to do with it!Do you need more prove ?
    If she really , had no idea , about that , she would have said , I will go and check it , for you.Right ???

    So , then later , I was thinking , why , I had to wait for 2 whole days , before we could meet.If you know the answer , please tell me.
    Maybe , she was still busy , with dates , with other men.Most other dates , after the 1st one , were during the day time.And would end at around 4 or 5 o`clock.

    I had 1 date alone with her , and then we went , to the other expensive restaurant , in the city.But , fair is fair.She didn`t order very expensive bottle of champagne or wine.
    Maybe , her plan was , to do it on the 7th date , which never came.

    The other thing , that I told the translator , was , that she was a little young.She had a piercing , in her nose , which I did not see, on the profile pics.I asked her , in one letter , to send me a daily photo from her.

    Well , maybe I should have realized it.But I thought , that it was a picture from someone else.But then again , how sure can you be , seeing the pic , on your monitor !

    So , it was a good lesson , and I was sure , that it would not happen to me again.
    If you don`t have a computer , in your hotel room , bring a smart phone , with internet access.So , you can check your corresponding.
    Print the profile pics , so you can compare , when you go overthere.

    Remember , photos , don`t need a battery , to look at them.Your smart phone can go defect , or you don`t have internet access.On my 1st trip , I had no smart phone with me.Just a simple thing , with which I could make phone calls to home.

    Of course , later , when I learned , that you can check , the pics , with Google images , I did so.And , sure enough , the photos were from a (famous) model.But , the woman , she had some resemblance , to that model.

    That`s it for now.

    Paul

  3. I have been in conversation with this lady since December 20th, 2014. I came to Nikolaev to meet her. SHe never arrived. We continued to talk online in chat, etc. She is now not responding to my emails and has taken many other men into her chat forum. She has requested me not to chat with other woman, but now she is chatting with other men. She has requested from me money to fly to Canada, which I sent her by Western Union. Since she acquired the money, she is now making excuses that she is unable to travel to me.

    I am requesting from her my money back many times, but she says we had no agreement and she cannot help me. Therefore, I request that she be notified of her profile to be deleted and banned from this dating site and any sites that are attached to this site immediately. SHe should be charged by the POLICE and thrown into prison for her ROMANCE SCAM that she has pulled on me.

    Here are some samples of our correspondence, you will see how she romanced me, then scammed me.

    Hello my sweet xxxert,
    Thank you for your letter, but I do not understand what you wrote about your work….But I think when I’m near you, you can explain to me more clearly, OK?
    Darling, I can’t put into words all the joy you brought into my life. The fact remains that love is something that can only be felt…and you make me feel great. In the past love has eluded me, and left only memories of unbearable pain. I was like broken into a million pieces and stopped believing in the existence of true love.
    You turned my life into a story full of romance and happiness. You didn’t demand anything from me and was always there though, and so far away from me… You gathered up the pieces of my heart and caused him to knock reminded of how to love and be loved. I fell in love with you for real and this time I will not miss your love.
    Beloved, with you I started to believe in “happily ever after”, and hope in our tale will be that way.
    Every day is filled with joy just because I think of you…..Every time on my face a smile, just because I say your name….You’re my angel, my life, my rock…I love you, cherish you and very much afraid to lose you….
    You gave me new life and I wanna live it with you…

    Hello dear xxxert,
    Thanks for your answer, I just don’t find places from your silence….You give me hope in a better and happy life with you))
    No, honey, I’m going to travel to Odessa. In Nikolaev no safe path as last time, I can’t miss there…I tried when I wanted to go to you….
    I will travel to Odessa and from there to fly to you, OK?

    Hello dear xxxert,
    Thank you for your letter… I love you and I want that we were together…
    I understand your excitement, because I can assure you that I will try to go another safe way, but still I will have to pass through checkpoints and probably some military bribes. But it’s okay because I’ll go to you and I want everything went well….
    I think that the dollars will be easier for me to get and to change here in Ukraine, probably because the Euro will I have problems.
    You’re going to write me a confirmation code, which I can withdraw money?
    Don’t write all the number in the letter, because the site can block it(write for example 1 and 2 and 3, OK?)

    Dear xxxert
    Hello my sweet xxxert,
    Thank you for your letter and for talking in chat…I’m Sorry that I finished today, it very quickly, there were some problems with the Internet, and now when I have time to write you a letter…
    I am very happy that we found each other here, I very strongly love you and want to make our future much better and more beautiful….
    How are you today? What are your plans for the day and at night?
    I miss you…I will wait for your letter and maybe later, when the Internet will work better, I’ll see you in chat…
    I love you, your Anna!

    Anna (Annushka) Morozova from Luhansk, Ukraine, aged 35, never married, no children

    • Bert, thanks for your comment.

      First off, I’d like to say “sorry” that you’ve had these problems. With that said, thanks for having the courage to step up and share your experience so that other Men can learn from your (and my) mistakes.

      For anyone considering going overseas to meet a Woman for marriage, I STRONGLY encourage you to go to the first page of this blog and begin reading my earliest posts. I went through this process, same as many of you are, and I fell into many trap doors and pitfalls. But eventually, I was triumphant and I am now happily married with my first child on the way.

      Every single “mistake” that you made in your search was spelled out on this website. Had you been here before you started sending ‘Elena’ money, you would have seen the scam and avoided it. But there are many other Men who are talking to other ‘Elenas’ who go by other names. If they follow the rules I’ve laid out how to avoid these scammers.

      In your case Bert, by following ANY of these rules, you would have avoided this problem.

      1. Don’t EVER send money to a Woman you haven’t met. Even if you have met her, be extremely skeptical of any requests for money. Alana (my Russian Wife) just commented to me, “Women who are interested in marriage don’t want you to send them money.”

      2. Most Russian/Ukrainian Women can’t get a visa to come and visit you. Sending her money to come to Canada is a waste of time and a clear indication of a scam. YOU MUST GO AND VISIT HER. For Men who have no plans to visit Ukraine or Russia in the next 6 months, keep looking at the photos of the pretty Women but forget about having a serious relationship this year.

      3. Don’t work with an agency that won’t give you the Women’s email address and phone number. Once you have her phone # and email address you should immediately Google search both and see what comes up. Additionally, take her photos and do a Google image search. If you find that her photos are on 3 websites with 3 names, you know its a scam.

      4. Once she emails you, go to the top of the email and click “show full headers.” You will see a list of IP addresses that the email channeled through from Ukraine to Canada. In the case of Elena, you would see that the originating IP address was in Odessa, not Nikolaev – a sure sign of a scam. I had many Russian Women email me (supposedly) from St. Petersburg but their IP address was in Kazan. Run, don’t walk from IP address mismatches. They are A SURE SIGN OF A SCAM.

      5. During correspondence, ask SPECIFIC QUESTIONS, like, where were you born? What is your favorite color? Have you traveled to other countries? How many siblings do you have? If the reply is, “Bert, there is no other Man like you. I dream of walks together, holding hands, gazing into each other’s eyes,” then you know its a scam. I emailed Alana 20 questions and I got 20 answers. Her next set of questions were in response to my questions – like a real conversation! Treat all correspondence with great skepticism. Remember, there is always a sucker in the room. If you don’t know who the mark is, it is probably you!

      6. Any Woman who tells you that she “loves you” and has never met you is a 100% bona fide scammer. Run, don’t walk.

      I’ve left your comment intact because I want the other Men to read what kind of emails they can expect to see from a scammer.

      Last comment, think with the Big head, not the Little head. Ignore the emotion and excitement of finding love that probably doesn’t exist. The VAST MAJORITY of online profiles are scams that are attached to real scammers and their ONLY intention is to take your money. Go to a reputable site (I know of only two) and meet some real Women. Email at first, then have a Skype video date and then fly out and meet them. There is no substitute for getting up off of the sofa and doing your own due diligence.

      Good luck!

    • Last comment, forgot to add – forget about sending this Woman to the police, forget about getting your money back. No one in Ukraine cares that a rich Canadian got fleeced by a clever local girl. In fact, the locals probably are proud of this girl for bringing your hard earned Canadian dollars into their impoverished country. Imagine if a bunch of rich Men from China or Singapore came to your town and snatched up all the young pretty Canadian girls. Would you care if Jiu Lin lost a few thousand? You probably wouldn’t care less and neither does INTERPOL or the Ukrainian Police.

      The marriage agency scams only exist because there are those of us foolish enough to send our money over there without too much thought. Not shame on Elena, shame on you and me.

    • Sorry to hear the news man.
      Ouch!
      I would encourage you to not give up on your search. The minor setback you received is still less traumatic than being cheated on and divorced from a Canadian woman…just think about the misery you would eventually have to deal with after settling for a western feminist woman.
      Feminine foreign women are better.

  4. Hi Bert ,

    It really surprised me , that you are so eager , to send money to her.Yes , I understand , that these women , can let your head run wild.And , for sure , you need to be strong , to let them not fool you.

    Well , I didn`t sent money , to them , but I sure got scammed.And , you know what they say , you live and learn.

    That said , the good advice , is to go there and meet them in person.But , there is a but ….. , you may not succeed on your first visit.
    Don`t let it put you down.Just try to , see how life is over there , and try to understand , their tradition and culture.

    If you never , had any involvement , with E European people , you will need some adjusting to them.

    Then there is the process , of getting to know each other.In some situations , it may go fast.In my situation , well , I kind of just bursted , into her life.
    We had no previous correspondence or communication.I was already in her city , and then asked , to have a meeting , with her.

    Of course , this can make things a bit complicated.Was she already , in a somewhat , serious affair , with another man ??
    Did she , had meetings , with men , recently , before , I asked to see her ??

    It is then , even the more important , that you check out her body language.How she behaves , what she will say and do , if it concerns you.
    If , everything , will go in the positive direction , it is still not certain.

    On the second last dinner , before I had to leave , on my first trip , I wanted to test her.To check if she was a scammer , or not.
    So , I said , that I could send her some money , every month , when I was back home.I didn`t say what amount.

    She looked at me , really surprised.As , if she had not expected this offer , from me.
    She waited a little while , then she told the translator , that it was not necessary.
    The translator said to me , when she is ready , she will tell you.

    Her answer , gave me mixed feelings.It could mean , that she was in sort of , serious correspondence , with someone else.Or maybe very serious.
    Or she was not sure , how the relation , with the other men , would evolve.

    On the other hand , I was glad , that she didn`t want my money.
    And , then there was her body language , which all in all , gave me only positive signs.So , in general , I was oke , with the situation.

    If , you will ever go there , don`t rush things.Take your time , and for sure , give her time , to get used , to this new affair.
    And , don`t forget , she , may like you very much.She may even fall in love , with you.

    But , the final word , will still come , from her family.She , will most of the time , hear , to what her family , thinks , about this relationship.
    And , in most cases , she will follow her family`s decision.

    All the best in your search , to find your partner

    Paul

  5. Paul,
    You mentioned family.
    —————————–
    But , the final word , will still come , from her family. She, will most of the time, hear, to what her family, thinks, about this relationship. And, in most cases, she will follow her family`s decision.
    —————————–
    In general how much weight will their approval carry? 25 percent, 50 percent, or something else? Also do you mean immediate family, extended family, or a broad social network of distant relatives, family friends, and acquaintances?

    • Hey Seeker and Paul,

      First Paul. It looks like you may be on your way to something special. Meeting all of those family members and mom coming all the way from Simferopol (no short train ride, I can assure you) to Odessa, is a strong sign. Your engagement description parallels closely to what I had written about some weeks ago. Wish you the best, my friend.

      Seeker. Your question on which family members can play into their daughter’s future life and how much is a good question. I have personal experience and a client experience for some reference.

      2 Ukrainian ladies that I dated and pursued, did not allow themselves to become serious with me based on what they thought their parents (90% mom) would not accept our age differences.

      My own wife had decided to convince her mom first and then allow mom to convince her dad. What convinced mom and then dad, was simply the happiness of my wife. My wife is strong willed and does what she feels best and although respects her parents, feels that she make her own decisions (that’s the lawyer in her). The first two ladies I mentioned, were not as strong minded and didn’t like to sway the boat with their parents.

      1 client of mine had a great skype relationship with a lady that we found for him. It was last year and I was safety concerned for any of my clients and advised that they meet in Poland, due to the geo-political situation in east/south Ukr. Our translator went along and after a week together all was great. They had an emotional good-bye and I thought another couple was to be had.

      After some time at home, her grandmother worked her over pretty well, worried about her granddaughter leaving Ukr for another country. This young lady had a child and the father was making waves about the child leaving, too (even though he was a non-paying, unstable man). Sadly, it didn’t work for them, and my translator and I believe that the words from grandma and perhaps mom (whom this young lady lived with), had great bearing on her change of heart.

      Conclusions from my experiences:

      + Ukr ladies and their mom’s are like best friends. Ukr ladies tell their mom’s everything. Probablly comes from the beginning years, as you know, Ukr mom’s stay home minimum of 3 years with their babies.

      + Even best friends won’t know as much as mom. I noticed that Ukr’s don’t like to share deep information with best friends, acquaintances, or friends. My best guess as to this stems from Soviet times, when telling someone something could land you into the gulag.

      + When you adore your wife, always keep mom happy, too. She’s the bridge to winning and finalizing your lady’s heart. So, when you meet mom and thereafter, always remember flowers or sweets for her, too.

      • Hi Rodney ,

        Thank you for your kind words.Yes , I was aware , that it was quite , a long trip , from Simferopol to Odessa.

        The reason , that she was there , was that her mother-in-law , was in a critical condition.And , she was there also , to support her husband.

        Sadly , 4 days ago , my girlfriend told me , that her grandmother had died.
        She will go over , to pay her respect (I believe , with other relatives).

        As , we all know , the situation in Crimea has changed.And from what she said , it is not good.Well , we can all figure this out.

        Just to be clear , having come to the point , that I had met , with her older sister , and her mother , was not “a walk in the park” , so to speak.

        Let`s face it.We had no previous correspondence or communication.A complete stranger , is asking , to meet her.
        We have several dates , and then , I had to leave.
        So , what would she think ??Was I honest and sincere ??

        Did I spoke the truth , to her ?Am I coming back , to see her ???
        Is there a possibility , that I will meet , a more beautiful woman ??
        Do I know , what I want ???

        Was she , in correspondence , with other men ??What were my chances , in all this ??

        Many men , forget , that when they have returned home , that it all , is just beginning.As we know , in a relationship , you have to work for it , and also put some energy into it.

        So , I was thinking about this.And by accident , I found , an internationally operating , flower ordering site.
        No , I didn`t wanted to use the one , from the dating site.

        The presents and bouquets , are just freaking expensive.Well , yes , I did send some flowers , when I was communicating , with some other ladies.
        But , I learned my lesson.

        So , it was then , when I begun , to send her these bouquets.Of course , you can order , chocolats and candy etc.
        And other gifts.I must say , that I`m really happy , with the way , they handle your order.
        You can also add a card , with your own text , to the bouquet.

        It is needless to say , that she was happy , to receive these gifts and flowers.
        And guys , just 1 important reminder : NEVER FORGET HER BIRTHDAY.

        Just so , you know!

        From my point of vieuw , I had to make up , for not having a correspondence or communication , prior to our first meeting.

        Yes , it`s true , these girls , have a strong bond with their mother.But also , with her older sister.
        I believe , that she is more inclined , to tell her older sister more of her secrets.

        You know , that in these situations , the older sister , is looking after the younger one.This also , creates a special bond.

        Something about her best friend.She was 1 of the witnesses , at her best friend`s wedding.
        So , do I know , who is going to be , at least one of them , at my wedding ??
        Well , I think , that I do .

        It was , on one of the dates , on my second visit , that she took me to the toy store.
        She didn`t tell me , but I believe , that she wanted to buy a doll , for the youngest daughter , of her best friend.

        The only doll , that the daughter wanted , was from the series / brand – Monster High.
        Maybe , it was for her birthday (but that I don`t know).

        Paul

  6. Seeker ,

    It is very much dependent , from what social background , she ,or her parents , come from.
    When I say family , I mean older/younger brothers , sisters.

    Of course , her parents opinion , will be a big issue.It may be , for this reason , that she will not tell or speak about you , with them , until she is really sure , if you are , what you pretend , and you do , what you say.

    It is also logical , that she will first , talk about you , with her older sister , if she has one.
    To talk about my own experience.

    On the first date , of my second visit , to her , she herself , brought up the topic , that she wanted , to introduce me , to her older sister.
    I had read and learned , about , using Google translate , to have a conversation.So , now , in the restaurant , we could use the wifi , to connect , to the internet.

    Well , to tell the truth , it was my first smart phone , so I needed , to figure it out , but I succeeded.She also , could get the connection , herself.
    But , then she didn`t know , to put the right language.And to get the correct keyboard.

    Which , gave me a hint , that she probably , had not the experience , to do it.So , she probably , may not have dated , that many foreigners.

    She then told me , that her “family” , had great concerns , about her acquaintance , with me.At that moment , I didn`t know , who she had told about me.
    Neither , of , what she had said , about me , as a person.

    To sum it all up.In a time frame , of 9 days , she introduced me , to her sister , her mother and her best friend.
    Her father , was not present , due to health issues , of his mother.Her mother , had to come from Simferopol to Odessa , to meet with me.

    Guys , yes , she did pass the mom check.So , you probably , will envy me now ??

    I found out , that she didn`t tell , too much about us , to her mother.On the date , with her friend , I asked her , when she told her , about me.
    She said , about a month ago , she started , to tell her , that I would come , to see her again.

    That was also , the time , when I got my ticket , and I did sent her , a copy of it.Already translated into Russian.
    So , she knew , I was not joking , and I would be there , on that day.

    On one of our last evenings , we were talking about , what she wanted.And , how the procedure is , you know , for the man , to ask her father , for her hand.

    Then , she told me , that the man , must come , with his whole family , to her house.I asked her , so I must come , with my entire family , to your house ????
    And she said , yes !!!

    Boy , did I had to think , for a while.

    But , luckily , in these modern times , it is not necessary , anymore.So , the man , with his family , will go to her house.
    If , for , what ever reason , she or her parents , do not condone , of the marriage proposal , they will put a pumpkin , outside the house , in front of the door.
    And close all the windows and doors.

    The man and his family , will notice this from afar.And then will understand , that they have no success.And will return home again.

    I also asked her , about an engagement.And about an engagement ring.
    So , then I let her read , what Google translate , had made of it.
    She looked a bit surprised , with a wondering expression , on her face.

    She said , I don`t understand , no good translation.I said , oke , and then re-phrased , the sentence.
    And now , it was clear , what I wanted to say.

    Then , she , wrote for me , what Google translate , had really made of it.

    Instead of an engagement ring , Google had translated , an engagement cling.
    Yes , this will surely , raise your eye brows.

    So , do I consider myself engaged ? Well , I am in it , with 1 foot already , yes.
    As far as I know , her mother and sister , are oke with it.And also , her best friend.

    Paul

    • Paul and Rodney,
      Thanks for the responses!
      A bit of info to digest but I guess the mother is the last hurdle but it seems like grandma, sister, and dad have a lot of pull. At least I would get to see the older female relatives…mom check…before the marriage if I were to go down that path.

  7. Hey:

    Very interesting post of yours, but I disagree with just one piece of it: Sometimes, the fact that she introduces you to her sister, or any other member of her family, it’s not always a good sign. From time to time, it happens that her sister or anyone of her relatives is also involved in the scam. I’m mentioning this from first hand experience.

    All in all, I agree with your post for the most part.

    Regards!

    • I have already posted , my other reply.But coming , to think about it!!
      Did YOU , REALLY KNEW , THAT IT WAS HER SISTER ??

      Was there any way , that you could verify this ???You know , people can say , all that they want.But unless , you have no way , whatso ever , to check it out , it will always be a gamble.

      In my case , I could be positive , that it really was her sister.I could verify this , from other photos.

      And , also , on her best friend , I had this prove.So , here , things are really indicating , that at least , she is open and sincere.

      Paul

  8. Hi David ,

    Sure enough , I had these thoughts myself , also.And , yes , I had always been , checking her attitude , her body language , and other signs , which may/could give me , some point of direction.

    In what way , her feelings , or thinking , about me , as a possible partner , may develop.First , there is her immediate reaction , when we are walking , and I lag a bit behind.She immediately , looks behing , to check , what I`m doing , or if I am still following her (done this several times , on different dates).

    When we had an appointment , to meet , I did wait , at a somewhat , remote place.When she would show up , and didn`t see me , you could clearly notice , the disappointment , and wondering look , on her face.And , when I would step over to her , there came this happy smile , all over her face.

    In my dealings , with women , I have to say , that she must be , a rather good actress , to fake this , or she is just plain happy , to see me.I have noticed this happy smile , on several dates.There are things , that you can`t just ignore , about a person`s body language.Also the greeting , then ,has a sense of joy , from her part.And , obvious , from me too.

    Then , there are the subtle signs , which women , may give you , when they really like you.I suppose , that I don`t need , to mention them here.
    Originally , I went over there , to meet , with someone else.
    Later I found out , that , she was a different person (not the same woman , from the profile photos).

    I could compare , her reactions (lady 1) , to these , of this lady 2.Just only after some dates , I was pretty sure , that it was not right (lady 1).I had to compare , her face , with that of the profile pics (lady 1) , several times , to really be sure (no , I had no smart phone – so no pics).
    And I didn`t print the profile photos – so after each date , I had to use the pc , to look for differences.

    With this woman (lady 2), things were completely different , on the first meeting.Read my other posts.While the translator (lady 1 ) , was making , all the arrangements , for the fake woman , in her situation (lady 2) , this translator , said , that she would not be present , at all , the dates.Only , occassionaly.

    As I said , she also , wanted to introduce me , to her best friend.First , we went to the toy shop , to buy some gifts , for her friend and for the 2 (older) children.She (we) had already bought , this Monster High doll , for the youngest one.Some days before.

    Then , we took a cab , to go to her friend`s work place.Where she bought some other small things.I must say , that none of these presents , were very expensive.After her friend , had finished work , we went back into town , to have dinner together.

    So , we had some conversation , and I asked the friend , when did she , tell her , about me.She said , it was a month ago.Which was also the time , that I had bought the ticket , and send a copy to her.
    Her friend is married , and has 3 children.

    She has known her , now , for 12 years.And , at her friends wedding , she was , one of the witnesses.
    Of course , there have been more events , on which , I can base my conclusion.

    Sure enough , nothing can be more fickle , than a woman.And , this is always , something , to consider.

    So , sorry , to hear , that you got scammed , in this way.For the moment , I keep my eyes open , and (try) , think with the big head.

    But , here is a suggestion , for you.Did HER mother , asked you , if YOU , have Russian MUSIC , at home ???

    Well , HER mother , did ask me , at some point , if I have Russian MUSIC !!!Because , she may have had , some doubts , about my intentions (with her daughter).

    I`m from Chinese decent , but do not have , all these typical physics.Because , I am a mix.For some , I have Asian characteristics , other women said , that I look like a Spaniard , or I can even go as a Mexican!!

    Well , you take your pick.

    So , I can understand , that her mom , could have had some doubts , here.The fact , that I do have Russian music , at home , seemed to put her mind , at ease , a bit.
    I said , yes , I have Russian music.Kozac music (which I really have).

    Those of you , who are a bit younger , will not know Ivan Rebroff (famous in the 60 – 70 -80s) , of whom I have records also.
    Of course , Kozac music , is a different style.

    So , if you want to impress , your future parents in law , buy some Russian music , and listen to it.That is , when you want to know , about their culture , tradition , and their thinking.

    Paul

    • “When we had an appointment , to meet , I did wait , at a somewhat , remote place.When she would show up , and didn`t see me , you could clearly notice , the disappointment , and wondering look , on her face.And , when I would step over to her , there came this happy smile , all over her face.”

      Bingo.

      • Yes , sure.And she already , had taken out her phone , to call me , and to ask , where I was.
        But , there was no need , because , then she saw me.

        These are very simple tricks , that you can do , to check , if she is really , into you.I don`t say , that it will happen right away.Of course , the relation must develop , and the feelings must grow.

        It was on the second , to last date , on the first trip.She was waiting , with the translator , for me.And she was looking around.

        Then , while she was turning her head , she noticed me , walking straight up , to her.And immediately , there was this big , happy smile , all over her face.

        She didn`t move her head anymore.Her eyes , were locked on me.And , then I saw , that she was scanning my body , from my feet , to my head.
        Inch by inch.

        Now , I know , that women , can instantly , have a picture , from , whatever situation.Because , their 2 brain halves , are wired differently.
        But , when she is scanning , your body , inch by inch , it means , that she wants , to edge , every detail , in her memory.

        So , if you don`t notice these things , you may do some reading , on women , in general.
        I don`t say , that I know , all about them , but for sure , somethings , I do understand.

        And , this was the first time , that I saw this happy smile , from ear to ear.On her face.
        I believe , that it was on the 7th or 8th date.

        It is very difficult , to fake this.And , I had only , 13 days left , in all , to go out with her , then.
        So , if you had understood this , then you know , that you have work to do.

        Paul

        • When you wake up one morning and find that she’s staring at you (admiringly, not like there’s a dead seal in the bed), well, that’s a good sign too…

          • Right on !
            I had this girlfriend , who did this , one time.She even gave me a kiss , on the forehead.

            Never noticed a thing ………
            Because I was still sleeping …….

            In the end though , she was just too feminist for me …………

  9. My advice is to learn Russian language and just go there to Ukraine or Russia and meet women naturally without a stupid interpreter. Yes, it is a difficult language to learn but worth it.

    • I agree Ben, the best approach is to learn Russian.

      For the other 99% of the Men out there, you should stick with English-speaking Women ;-)

  10. Hi Guys,
    I am from Hungary, and had the same experiences with these sites. Anastasiadate.com and ukraina-women.com are fully scammer sites.
    2 years ago at anastasia and now at uukraina-women I had the same experiences:
    Within 2 days over 100 very pretty, young, genuin and brilliant girls wrote me love letters (initially)! I’m over 55 y.o.! Even if she indicated on her profile up to 45 she is looking for….but mostly they were interested in men up to 70-76 y.o.! Alone that must make us suspicious! After 1.letter you are charged to read (!) and write letters to anybody of them! (At Anastasia I spent some $s writing letters, but not over 20 $s. It had no sense) If you try to tell them e.g.yr email, you will be banned/suspended. And at Ukraina-women I ‘ve learned you have to get min. 15 letters (and to be charged for) from a girl to get private email or tel.nr of her! So at that point I deleted my profile, thus came out from this only losing time.
    I advice you, never registrate on these sites.

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